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, New York, United published Jul 9th, 2008 |
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Dr. Cliff Pickover is the author of forty mind-expanding books at the edges of science, mysticism, and religion. His latest book is Archimedes to Hawking: Laws of Science and the Great Minds Behind Them.
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The jews have no right to Israel. So they lived there 2 thousand years ago or something, boo hoo. Does this mean i can travel to the town where my ancestors were dukes at about 900 years ago and claim it as mine? How does that make any sense whatsoever. Maybe they USED to live there. But that doesnt give them the right to forcefully take it from the current inhabitants. This isnt even about religion.
If you can make your claim to your ancestors' lands stick than go for it. The Jews have made it stick.
It was the Muslim colonial invaders and occupiers who originally kicked the Jews off their land and forced them into servitude and colonized Jewish Palestine, and the Jews have never conceded them ownership nor have the Jews disappeared, while what you call the 'current inhabitants' were foreigners who came into Palestine after the Zionists started to rebuild the land and make it worth stealing once again.
The whole land of Kan-an, Israel, Juda, Palestine should be leveled to the ground, and declared the forbidden land, Water should be let in from the Red sea to cover that damned land, so that humanity lives in peace and brotherhood... This whole my land is your land is my land is shit... GOOD EXCUSE FOR THE NEW WORLD ORDER THOUGH LOL.
GOD should punish mankind for his mistakes, he did it once to Adam and Eve for biting an apple !!! but he's not doing it again after all this massive horror and massacres, killings both sides of the inhabitants of Kan-an are inflicting on each other... THANX BUT I DON'T NEED A DOUBLE STANDARD GOD, WE'VE ALREADY GOT ALOTTA DOUBLE STANDARD LEADERS ON THIS WORLD LOL!
There is lots of ignorance in this world, where do you think the Muslims in Palastine/Israeal, Lebanon, Jordan and Egypt came from? they are the same people who were Jewish then they converted to Christianity then most of them converted later to Islam, we are still the same people just our grand fathers decided to switch faith. A DNA study was done on some people from israel, Lebanon, Jordan and Egypt, they all shared some strands of the same DNA, So let us stop the ignorance and label the Middle East conflict as an oil and power conflict and not as a religion or blood line one.
You are the ignorant one. The Muslims of Palestine came to Palestine from Syria, Egypt, Iraq, Sudan, North Africa in the last century in response to the human and financial investment of the Jewish people in rebuilding their beloved homeland there. They were never Jews and were never Palestinian, except for a few thousand landless Bedouin marauders, landless migrant workers, and landless sharecroppers. There were also a few foreigners left over from past illegal conquests or imported by the foreign Turkish or Egyptian occupiers. And those very few legitimate Muslim residents of the Jewish homeland forfeited their rights by trying to kill the Jews there.
My understanding is that the kingdom of Judah seceded from Israel after King Solomon's rule - so actually there were two Kingdoms namely Israel and Judah - and what is today called Israel is actually the Kingdom of Judah revived - the tribes which made up Israel (10 altogether) have never been found again (hence lost) since it's capture by Assyria. It is said that Israel will rise again but the modern State of Israel is really only Judah, Israel (the real one) does not exist or is still to be revived, within modern Judah (i.e. Israel today) I am not sure.
You are close. It was the Kingdom of Israel that seceded from that of Judah after King Solomon's rule. It was conquered and exiled by Ashur (Assyria, not identical to Syria). The Jews of today are from the tribes of Judah and Benjamin and of course Levi, but the other ten are in the process of being found and recovered, see
http://www.shavei.org//en
When many millions of Jews do return to Greater Israel, who include some of the fiercest fighters in the world, the Islamic Conquest and Arab Occupation of Jewish Palestine will come to an end.
Firstly, the question needs to be reframed. Otherwise, the question has whacked the hornet's nest and run away.
Israel did not sprout in a vacuum. Nor did Israel's "enemies". The current state of the middle east is the bastard of western opportunism. The whole mess is not a natural progression of its own internal struggles, aspirations, and capitulations, but as a frankinstein's monster of UK, USA, et al.
The real question is: Would the world be better off if the middle east had NOT evolved under the hegemony of superpowers who formed protective covenants with the local elite in exchange for acquiescence to theft of the region's resources, and military occupation towards further imperialism? Yes it would. Israel, Iraq, and similar wreckless artifices would not even exist . . . and that would be fine. Islam would NOT have soured into fundamental religious belligerence in reaction to inequities and turmoil caused by these handcrafted religiously supercharged dichotomies. 911 would not have been necessary. Religion is a mental disease, fostered and sustained by the fear-mongering elite. Bible, Torah, Koran are hoxes. Religion has no place in a better world. It is important to know the truth of who, what, and why . . .
-an American
"Religion is a mental disease..." It should be listed in the DSM-IV.
LOL that one hit the nail in the head. LMAO, I would put it under the category of substances of abuse.
Atheism is not a mental disease, it is an intellectual disease. There is no basis for the atheistic belief system, which forces its subjects to hide their heads in the sand.
This poll is completely bogus. It is worded in a way that is guaranteed to produce false results. It is confusing and misleading to ask if something is 'better' if something 'never'. Think about it. I bet on the order of half or more of the responses are from people who read this casually.
I certainly think the world is BETTER off that Israel WAS formed, and I found myself therefore voting 'better' before figuring out the reverse-switcheroo in the question. The whole thing is offensive and partronizing anyway. Israel is the one and only legitimate cvountry in the entire region. All the rest were created with crayons on maps after World War I. Not one of them existed as a country, and not one of them was ruled by Arabs.
Is the world better off that the Jews were evicted and excluded from historically Jewish trans-Jordan to form the 'Kingdom' of Jordan from eighty percent of Jewish Palestine? Dozens of thousands of people died to create and support that two-state solution fiasco.
Is the world better off that Jews were evicted and excluded to form Southern Lebanon out of the northern region of Jewish Palestine? Hundreds of thousands have died to support that two-state solution fiasco, and many thousands are being oppressed and brutalized by the Arabs there to this day.
Is the world better off that the terrorists were installed and institutionalized to form a 'Palestinian Authority' in the Jewish Palestinian heartland of Judea/Samaria, or historically Jewish Gaza?
Is the world better off that Jews were eviceted and excluded from Gaza a couple of years ago?
Is the world better off that Iraq was created
Is the world better off that Iraq was originally formed out of several groups of people who hate each other and wasnt to dominate and kill each other?
Religion is divisive and has been the root of nearly all wars in human history. Israel was not a bright place to look for peace. The problem has been that few countries have welcomed jewish people throughout the 20th century. So was there really much of a choice for Jewish people? The British created the nation of Israel under the Balfour Declaration as part of their plan to keep the former ottoman empire divided and keep what they considered proto-christians in charge of jerusalem. The fault here can't be placed too hard on jewish people, but the world at large for not being more welcoming to people of different religions/creeds. However there are fanatics of all religions and many of the settlers displacing and treating the original citizens in present day Israel as second class citizens or the government of Israel destabilizing the region has been a disaster. Please let moderation and reason triumph over fanaticism and religion...
2000 years is a long time to be pissed off about losing your home. How about the caananites for example what about their claims to the region or all the others that occupied that stretch of land over the last 3000 years?
Indeed it is true that Religion is divisive - but isn't that what Christ said he was doing anyway? Didn't he say unabashedly that he did not bring peace but division to the world?
The founding of Israel is the pivotal event in the eventual spreading of civilisation to all the world. Backwardness, intolerance, and anti-modernism as represented in the Islamic world will be seen by all to have failed. Progress will be slow and rocky, but Israel will prevail and eventually be accepted by its neighbours as they reform their faith
The world would be better place without them - The Christian religion is a piece of lies and shit and is not the original religion of the Caucasians. When the End is coming, remember ...
Mr. Guest, you seem to be under three misapprehensions: A) Judaism is not Christianity; B) Christianity AND islam are based on Judaism. By your reasoning, if one is "shit", then all three are; C) Arabs are Caucasians, and Islam is also not their original religion.
If and when "the end comes", each person will be judged on his or her individual merits.
Isreal is not a christian country you moron.
Judaism and Israel gave the world the Torah. This is the bible that both Judaic and Christian religions observe and accept. This is the testement that says Hashem gave Israel to the Jewish people. To deny this is to deny the promise of G-d and question His word and honesty. When the independent Jewish State of Israle was formed in 1948 the Israelis offered to be inclusive of all religions. The response was to be attacked by Egypt, Jordan and Syria the following day. Perhaps the world would have been better off if Egypt, Syria, and Jordan did not exist. Islam was formed 1,900 years after Moses and the Jewish people returned to Israel. When it comes to religion Islam is the new kid on the block. Seniority, alone, let alone the promise of G-d, gives Israel to the Judaic people.
"To deny this is to deny the promise of G-d and question his word and honesty."
What? Can't you just say it? God. God. God. God. Not G-d.
By the way. There is no God (or god).
Please keep in mind that the Koran says that Israel should exists, and thus Moslems who believe in the Koran may actually support the formation of Israel. For example: "And thereafter We said to the Children of Israel: 'Dwell securely in the Promised Land. And when the last warning will come to pass, we will gather you together in a mingled crowd,'" the Koran says in 17:104, The Night Journey. Another relevant verse is from Sura 5, verses 20 and 21:
“Remember when Moses said to his people: O my people, remember the favors that God bestowed on you when he appointed apostles from among you, and made you kings and gave you what had never been given to any one in the world. Enter then, my people, the Holy Land that God has ordained for you.”